A sincere discussion and question for all: Is it just that the end justifies the means, or why is it that Democrats seem to not be troubled by blatant, indisputable, dishonesty when it is pointed out to them?

One of the most curious things about Democrats and Progressives, is how they seem unfazed or concerned by any degree of dishonesty one might point out to them. I don't care what party I find myself in; if someone with influence is covering up, deceiving, manipulating, fooling, conning, vote buying, poll manipulating, conspiring, or just straight up lying - It concerns me. Dishonesty is wrong. If you are having to behave dishonestly, or find yourself un-bothered by dishonesty from those supposedly "on your side," then you've got your self a super duper, pregnant, sign that you are on the wrong side; You've got yourself a hand written invitation to do some soul searching to make sure that you haven't set aside some essential ideals - in your effort to satisfy your party's political and social "ideals de jour." Does your social justice seeking, politically correct, bleeding-heart-globalist, gay friendly, illegal immigrant adopting, Islam appeasing, America-last related goals and victories mean much, if everybody has to discard honesty, fair play, morals and truth - where perhaps just being a good person becomes a casualty of means justified by less profound ends?

When I see the left, almost as a rule, unconcerned and dismissive about glaring violations of honesty and ethics committed by those they support....

• What of Charles Rangel, Alen Grayson, Barney Frank, Harry Reid, Tim Gheitner, Chriss Dodd, Eric Holder..... the list goes on forever of Democrats that you and I both know, are dishonest and unethical - even down right crooked. Don't bother denying it and I won't bother insulting your intelligence by believing that you don't know full well that these guys are dishonest.
• What about the dozens of reports we're hearing of voter fraud by the left? Are every single one of the reports false; or, does voter fraud and corrupt elections jive with your ideals and morality? Perhaps just a few fixed elections are okay, but only because the rules and policies that the extra votes will bring about - are just so great that it's worth it?
• What about Erica Holder denying all in response to the two credible, senior attorneys that have both come forth claiming that Eric Holder has established a policy where only crimes committed by white people will be prosecuted. Does it bother you that, if these claims are true, then Eric Holder is lying through his teeth and deceiving the public - - in addition to committing some hefty discrimination related crimes. If this doesn't rock your boat either - is it because it's not that big of deal if the attorney general is lying and making racial discrimination federal policy? or, are you not bothered because you don't believe a bit of it - and, this story is 100% untrue and made up just like the voter fraud stories - and the rest of allegations ever brought for about the left?
• What about Obama saying health care cost wouldn't go up - and, we would get to keep our doctors, and it wouldn't be a tax? These statements to the American citizens were not the truth; and, after claiming it wasn't a tax in order to get the votes to pass health care, the Obama team now insists that it is a tax because that's the only way to pass it off as constitutional during the court battles currently going on. Does this bother you? Or, do you think it's okay that the lies were told, because of how important it was to nationalize health care? Or?
• What about Obama having the entirety of his past school records sealed - and how he has spent over 5 million dollars hiring lawyers to prevent and disclosure? I agree that a President shouldn't necessarily have to make everything public and not have the right to keep some personal stuff private. Fair enough; but, does it not concern you at all - that Obama will disclose no records at all and that he continues to put so much effort and money into preventing disclosure? Does that bother you at all? Does it seem at all dishonest, or at least, disconcertingly secretive? If not, is it because why? Is it because the transformations that Obama is achieving are so great, that it doesn't really matter if he's lied about his past or not - or if there be any kind of skeleton in those records, or not? Or, is it, again, that you don't believe a bit of it - and that he has all of his records online and the sealed documents, the law suits, - all of it made up by opposition just like the "birther" BS?

In your responses, I'm curious to better understand why Democrats and Progressives seem disinterested and unconcerned with particular reports and allegations of dishonest and unethical behavior - that seem to me to be very troubling. Troubling, not only because of possible deception or harm against the Citizens that might result; troubling also because of how bad of people some people are - if any of it is true. And, troubling that people think such dishonesty and bad character is acceptable and not totally despicable, shameful, infuriating and wrong. What is it? Is it no big deal if it ever becomes the case where most every official and leader is totally untrustworthy and corrupt? or if everybody is pretty much manipulative and untrustworthy because, we are all justifying the means by our own desired ends? Do you think we should just grow away from the concept of universal truths and get past the outdated notion that goodness caries any distinctively divine importance - stop thinking that being a good person is any kind of universal point - where being good should be our universal or even standard goal in life.

So, which is it for you?

1. The ends justify the means.
2. The reports are all lies. If any were true I would be bothered and concerned.
3. I don't think goodness or honesty is all that important so I don't really care if someone is honest and ethical or not.
4. It's something else that you are missing which I'll explain with my comment post..